1 Feb. 1330-1610 hours man had on many occasions come to the Japanese Embassy to see both the Military and Naval Attaches on business matters, and apparently he was also acquainted with Ribbentrop. It was he who first approached me about this matter and I believe it was through his suggestions to Ribbentrop that he came to me to sound me out as to how the Japanese Military would feel about this matter. This man Hack had been in Japan for a long time and I believe had been an adviser to the South Manchuria Railway among other things, so that he would know of conditions in Japan, and it must have been his suggestion to Ribbentrop that brought him to me, as representative of the Military, and because he must have told Ribbentrop that the Japanese Army would be more interested in this pact than anyone else. Q. Was this man a member of the German Military? A. No. He was a salesman of the Heinkel Aircraft Company. 2 Q. Why would he as a salesman for the Aircraft company be interested in a pact against Russia? A. I did not say that he had been directly interested in this pact. I simply meant that this man had dealings with Ribbentrop also. Of what nature I do not know, and Ribbentrop must have spoken to him of whom he should see in the Japanese Embassy. Q. It is not clear to me yet the interest of this man. If I understand correctly he was a German salesman for airplanes and airplane parts: that he knew Ribbentrop, that he was sent by Ribbentrop to see you. Is that correct? A. Yes, that is so. Q. But you knew this salesman; had you had conversations with him before Ribbentrop sent the salesman to see you? A. Yes, because Hack had come to us many times before (on these business matters). Within our department we had an officer who was interested in the purchasing of technical equipment from Germany and he was continually calling upon representatives of the Heinkel Factory to come and see him, and in this way we had connections with this man for a long time. Q. Had you ever discussed with Mr. Hack the subject matter of this proposed alliance against Russia with Germany? A. Yes, I had discussed with him, and in this regard, if you desire, I shall tell you of the events leading up to this pact in detail. Q. Let me first inquire, did you discuss this subject with Hack before Hack was sent to you by Ribbentrop to talk about it? A. No. I shall tell you all I know about this pact including secret matters pertaining to it. To start with it was in the spring of 1935, in May or June, I believe, that Hack came to me and said the following was Ribbentrop’s own idea and had nothing to do with the policy of the German Government, but would there not be a possibility of some sort of defensive alliance against Russia between Germany 2 The Japanese purchased 12 Heinkel fighter planes which they used in the Invasion of China in 1937. However, these aircraft were not used in the attack on Pearl Harbor. By then the Japanese had the Mitsubishi Zero which was a remarkably good airplane for use on aircraft carriers. This airplane and torpedo bombers were used in the attack. The Zero was the most maneuverable airplane in the war at low speeds and had exceptional range. Its defect was that it was easily destroyed because it was very light. It was also under-powered. Nevertheless, it was formidable early in the war because of its fantastic maneuverability, until the U.S. started using the F6 Hellcat and the F4 Corsair which each had 2000 h.p. engines. 18