5 March 1946 A. Yes. Q. He was expelled because of suspicion that he had attempted to overthrow the Afghanistan Govern- ment, wasn’t he? A. I believe the Japanese officer became friendly with an Afghanistan “garrison commander” and suggested to him that they carry on Anti-Russian activities. This man evidently passed on this word to the Afghanistan Government and suggested that they get rid of the Japanese officer before they were suspected of doing such things. Q. That man was working under your direction or out of your office in Berlin, was he not? A. No. I had no connection with him. Q. But you intended to send someone there to take his place after he was expelled, did you not? A. No. Q. How often have you seen Himmler? A. Very seldom; I had no official dealings at all with his office. Q. Do you remember the occasion of a visit he made to your office or to you - I do not know if it was in your office or not - on January 31, 1939, or thereabouts? A. I have no remembrance of that date. Q. Maybe I can help you remember it. On that occasion you discussed with him a good many subjects; one of those subjects was the speech that Hitler had made at or about that time; then the next subject you discussed with him was the conclusion of a treaty to consolidate the triangle, Germany and Italy, and Japan, into an even firmer mold. I assume that has reference to the Tripartite Pact. Do you remember a discussion on that subject with Himmler? A. I do not recollect the meeting. Q. Maybe you will recollect this: according to your statement made the other day, when you first mentioned the White Russians, you indicated that this agreement to obtain intelligence about the Russian Military and exchange it with Germany came into being around September or October 1938. Now, this is about the meeting to which I am referring. It took place either three or four months after this agreement that was entered into that you have already told us about. In addition to the matters I have asked you about, my information is to the effect that you on that occasion also discussed with Himmler the matter of these activities with respect to Russia. I have in my hands, General, a copy of Himmler’s report on that meeting and he said that you also told him that, together with German counter-espionage, you were undertaking long-range projects aimed at the disintegration of Russia and emanating from the Caucasus and the Ukraine. He also said that this organization was to become effective only in case of war. Now, you have already told us that these White Russians were working out of the Caucasus and this was about three months or four months after you entered into the agreement to do this intelligence work with the White Russians. Now, does that help you remember anything about that meeting that you might enlarge upon what I have just told you? 2 A. I have no recollection of the meeting. I might have spoken to Himmler at some time, but never of coordinating this type of work or anything of the sort. 2 This report was produced not under interrogation, but before Himmler had been captured because when they identified him, he bit a poison capsule and killed himself. 179